The CEO Mindset for Dealing With Crisis (A Founder's Story)

Sean Weisbrot: Welcome back to another episode of the We Live To Build podcast. Today's a special episode for me because we're going to get deep into the psychology of helping your loved one through an illness that could potentially kill them, and how that affects you and your business and why helping them cultivate a sense of purpose will help them through it, and why developing a support network will help you through it.

Sean Weisbrot: Our guest is Vladimir Gendelman, the founder of Company Folders. He's based in Michigan and was born in the Soviet Union and immigrated to America. I love this episode because meeting Vladimir opened me up to the importance of why not only myself, but all of you should be looking for Masterminds and other entrepreneurs that can push you.

Sean Weisbrot: To improve yourself no matter what that direction is. And so even though you'll hear about Entrepreneurs Organization and I'm not a member, meeting him has made me curious about joining them in my research, looking for investors for the company. Because we're getting ready to close out our seed round.

Sean Weisbrot: I've discovered a whole wealth of. These kinds of communities out there that I'm gonna seek to partner with professionally to promote my company's product, but also an opportunity for me to meet a diverse group of organizations that I. Have support networks that I could potentially learn from. And just like doing the podcast where I interview CEOs and other people who are quite successful, far more successful than myself, I believe that any of us hoping to make a giant leap in our careers.

Sean Weisbrot: Need to surround ourselves with these kinds of people. I know it's relevant for probably a lot more of you out there than you realize, and just know that if you're going through this kind of an experience helping someone who you love who is sick, it's hard, but it's not impossible, and you're not alone.

Sean Weisbrot: This is probably not an easy thing that we're gonna be covering today, but it's something that I think is really important because from my experience talking to entrepreneurs, I've found that a lot of people have very similar experiences because we're human. And one of those is enduring a loved one, uh, becoming sick.

Sean Weisbrot: And in some cases they recover. In some cases they don't. In your case, she recovered and that's amazing and I'm really happy for that. And the experience you went through has changed you. I think it's really important for people to understand. I. How that experience can change a person and how they can establish a support network to help them.

Sean Weisbrot: So why don't you tell everyone a little bit about your business and then we will move towards, you know, how your wife got sick and, and all of that.

Vladimir: So I started my company back in 2003 and the company is called Company Folders and we are a printing company that specializes in presentation folders, binders, and envelopes.

Vladimir: Um, so it's now been 18 years going strong. We are B2B environment where we do work for other companies that are big and small across the board.

Sean Weisbrot: At what point in the. Lifetime of your business. Did your wife get sick?

Vladimir: She was diagnosed, uh, with ovarian cancer in February, 2019. So at the time the company was 16 years old.

Vladimir: From the business perspective and personal perspective or any other perspective, there really is never a good time to be sick and, and this particular incident happened when we were in actually Colorado skiing. That's when my wife felt pain and went to emergency room and everything seemed to be fine.

Vladimir: She had a procedure there. Nobody thought about cancer. And then we came back a few days later, the doctor called that they did biopsy and. Unfortunately you do have ovarian cancer. Luckily it was in the very early stage, so we had more options and um, we went from there.

Sean Weisbrot: So what was your first thought or feeling when the doctor said it was cancer?

Vladimir: My wife was hysterical in complete shock and disbelief. As, as you can only imagine, that automatically put me on the other side where I have to be more reasonable, I guess. More leveled and figure out a way to calm her down.

Vladimir: Another thing that I think helped me a lot is that I do own the business. And while nothing like this ever happened before, but problems do come up all the time, right?

Vladimir: And when problems come up over the years, I learned to take the emotion out and strictly try and deal with the fact. So I applied the same principle here as well, and I did not let my emotions be affected for actually quite a while, almost until the end. Through the process, my biggest concern was if something happens, can I raise the kids and I know I can be a good dad.

Vladimir: But the bigger question was, can I be a good mom? And with all honesty, I don't think I will make that good of a mom. That thought scared me a little bit. Plus, um, I obviously did not wanna lose my wife by any means because we have an amazing marriage and great relationship and really, really good family.

Vladimir: So I wanted to keep it that way. So when we found out, I turned into problem solving mode, and ironically you said that how I started the business and everything doesn't affect this, but maybe it, it did to a certain extent because in my company we do compete on having. The widest array of options, uh, than anybody else out there in the sense of we have the widest array of printing methods and paper choices and, and on and on.

Vladimir: So my biggest thing was let's figure out what all the options are for this and then start selecting from them. We were also fortunate enough where we had some kind of, um, connection to the best oncologist, the best oncologist, gynecologist who helped with the surgery, who helped with chemo treatment and everything else.

Vladimir: To answer your original question, I did feel fear a little bit, and from there on it turned into problem solving and let's get this thing done.

Sean Weisbrot: So how did you calm her down?

Vladimir: In a situation like that, it is really, really hard to calm somebody down, especially when you yourself do not have an authority to do that.

Vladimir: Meaning that if I was a specialist in cancer, right, and I seen situations like that before and I could tell her, oh, this is not a big deal. If there is a procedure, we'll go through it. I'm not that authority. The best thing I could do is like every time she would get emotional and like I always brought up the fact that it doesn't have to happen, right?

Vladimir: There are other things that could happen that are much better, that are good. Also, I try to keep her focus and my focus together on how we are dealing with this and how we are fixing this as opposed to what might happen, and I actually think it helped quite a bit. Also, we went to see this amazing oncologist who administered the chemo, and he helped quite a bit as well, because he had the authority of being an oncologist and seen situations.

Vladimir: And he actually looked at my wife and he said, you'll be fine. But the way he did it. You kind of felt that you'd be fine, so that helped as well. At later points, I would remind her that remember Dr. Margoles said you'd be fine.

Sean Weisbrot: Was there anything else you guys did like changing her diet or getting her to exercise more?

Sean Weisbrot: Anything that you felt was helpful for her mood or for the outcome? Of the chemo and things like that.

Vladimir: Ironically, with all this, my wife is a healthy person to begin with as far as the food and everything goes and exercises as well. She did not stop the exercises. She was limited in what she could do, but she was doing as much as she could on the days that she could because around the chemo time, few days after, that's when you feel your worse.

Vladimir: And from the diet perspective, she went all vegan, absolutely no alcohol at all. Not that she was drinking a lot before, but even socially, that completely stopped. So her last chemo was two years ago in August of 2019, and she only started having occasional drinks here and there this year. We also did the test.

Vladimir: There is a test you can do, it's a blood test that shows internal inflammations that certain foods can cause. We did that and, and I don't remember exactly what her foods are. I think one of them is peanuts or cashews that causes internal inflammations. So all that got cut out and then of course a big portion of that was.

Vladimir: Her hair because during chemo, people lose their hair. But there is a procedure called cold capin. It's this really, really cold helmet that gets frozen down to like minus 40 degrees peren height. And when you put it in your head and you keep it there for a certain amount of time before the chemo administers, and then for another four hours after, it basically freezes your, uh, hair follicles and they do not get affected by chemo.

Vladimir: Through the whole process. By doing that, we were able to save my wife's hair, which is extremely important for person's psyche. 'cause her point was, if I lose my hair, I'm gonna look sick. If I look sick, I'm gonna feel sick. Plus you lose your privacy of people constantly looking at you like, oh, do you have cancer?

Vladimir: What's going on? Why are you like that? And so on, so forth. So she actually had a choice of who she shared it with and who she didn't because on the outside. Should never change. So that was also a big deal. And together with it, there are a lot of limitations during that process because your head cannot sweat during the whole process of chemo.

Vladimir: And then I think two or three months afterwards. So that limits the exercises. You can do. You cannot wear a hat, uh, you have to wash your hair a certain way and on and on and on. My wife stuck through all of that and, and her hair is as beautiful as it ever was.

Sean Weisbrot: I love the cold cap. I did a little bit of research on it after our intro call and it's definitely interesting you had said something like that.

Sean Weisbrot: Now she works with cold cap to help other people

Vladimir: during chemo process. Those helmets as they get frozen, they have to be replaced every 30 minutes 'cause they get warm where they wear masked. And this lady who was helping my wife do that, shared with us that. Most women do not do cold caps because insurance doesn't cover it.

Vladimir: They can't afford it, and it's expensive, and so on and so forth. So the cold cap and each time costs about $600. My wife had six rounds of chemo, so that's $3,600 right there. There are some people who go 10 rounds, 20 rounds, even 30 rounds. Then becomes extremely expensive. And as we were going through this, the one thing my wife couldn't stop thinking about is, oh my God, there are women out there or people out there who would like to save their hair, but they can't afford it.

Vladimir: That is horrible and I need to figure out a way to help them. So she ended her chemo, as I mentioned, in August of 2019. And in the spring of 2020, she started looking into how she could help others and what it would take. And through that she contacted the, the company that provides cold caps and she started talking to them about what she wants to do and how she can work with them and everything else.

Vladimir: And, and they mentioned that there are few other women in our area who are trying to do the same thing. And they connected my wife with them and as she connected with them, turned out that they all live within, I don't know, 20 minutes of us, which was extremely convenient and. They are also in the very beginning stages.

Vladimir: So my wife joined them and together, six of them started this nonprofit called K and Conquer. And their whole mission is to help cancer patients save their hair by sponsoring it for them.

Sean Weisbrot: So it sounds like. Your wife had developed this sense of purpose as a result of the experience, which gave her a will to live, to fight the cancer and to make sure it never comes back. I think the way that you helped her by reaffirming what the oncologist said, that you'll be fine. And by trying to be that solid presence that's trying to solve problems and, and encouraging her to have this partnership with these other women has probably been one of the most important things she's ever experienced in her life.

Vladimir: I would definitely say so because the sense of purpose is very strong. They launched the nonprofit, they kept in Concur in September of last year, September of 2020, like when they went live and right away through online and late people they know, know, I don't remember exactly how much money they raised, but over the first few months.

Vladimir: They sponsored like eight or nine people right away. By now, they have sponsored, I believe, over 40 people that did cold caps and, and saved their hair. And yesterday they had their first big event, which was a golf out. And, uh, in between the sponsorship and people playing golf and silent auction, they ended up raising a lot of money that will sponsor many, many more patients.

Vladimir: As of right now, they're doing everything themselves. So they did not hire any employees. Therefore, there is absolutely no administrative costs. All the money that comes in goes back to the people.

Sean Weisbrot: Have you stepped in at all to like, provide advice for her for this, or you just completely go, this is your thing.

Sean Weisbrot: I'm happy to share in your joy with it, but I'm gonna let this thing be yours.

Vladimir: In the very beginning, I really wanted to do advice and I tried, and then I quickly realized that it's not my experience, it's her experience. It's way better if she does things on her own, and my advice should only be limited to when she really comes and asks for something.

Vladimir: So it took me a little bit of time to get to that point, maybe a month or so. But now it's completely her thing. And once in a while she would ask me or she would talk about something they're dealing with. And then if I. Have some kind of expertise or, or, or knowledge in that area. I would definitely, uh, volunteer that.

Vladimir: On top of that, I also, so I created their logo, I did their business cards, like whatever, printing, I could do all the signage for them. Yeah, things like that.

Sean Weisbrot: So through all this, how did you handle it on your business side? I know you said you're used to problem solving. I know you said you tried to remove your emotions from it, but really, was that possible?

Sean Weisbrot: Were you able to really separate your emotions and how did that affect your business and your team?

Vladimir: So, first of all, I would like to do a disclaimer that probably the way I felt at the time and the way I think I felt back then looking backwards are probably not exactly the same, just because how we experience things and then how we remember them later are usually a little bit different.

Sean Weisbrot: That's amazing. So few people would think about that.

Vladimir: So with that said, my recollection of the whole thing is I was obviously distracted. The whole focus and concentrating on what I needed to do was harder than usual. And, and, and I would say that my whole focus obviously was not there. I had to miss more work than I usually would 'cause we had.

Vladimir: You know, doctor appointments and this and that. And then sometimes if my wife wasn't feeling well, like I would be with her to the best of my ability. Plus a lot of thoughts come into your mind that, you know, I, I try to push out as much as I can, but you know, we're still human beings, so it only works so much.

Vladimir: So was I. Extremely successful at just pushing this out and run business as usual. No, but I do have an amazing team that ran the company while I wasn't there and, and did everything they, they usually do anyways. Everybody's a professional and I would like to think that the company did not skip a bit with all that.

Sean Weisbrot: So do you feel like permanently you have seen a change in how you run your company because of that time that they spent taking more of your responsibility, or did that go back to the way it was before this all happened afterwards? When she was okay.

Vladimir: From my recollection, probably went back to how it was before.

Vladimir: With that said, I would imagine that. I'm probably a little bit more hands off now than I was prior to that experience, which is great because that allows my team to do what they do and to do it well, which essentially is better for everybody

Sean Weisbrot: I know for sure. When I'm not around as much, my team does better, so I try to just leave them a alone.

Sean Weisbrot: Yep. So I learned to do that as well in our intro call. You mentioned a support network that you work with called Entrepreneurs Organization. Why don't you tell me how they helped you get through this?

Vladimir: So I joined EO or Entrepreneurs Organization in 2012, and the whole premise for the organization is for entrepreneurs to help each other and EO facilitates by having educational events via speakers and people with experience.

Vladimir: And the really big component there is structure of a forum. So forum. Is a group of people typically between six and 10, that meet usually once a month for about four hours in a very strict structure that's provided by eo, whom we're actually trained for it. We're trained on how to run forum, and we're also trained on how to communicate during forum, where everything comes from the experience share as opposed to advice.

Vladimir: This creates incredibly safe environment to share what's bothering you and most importantly, get. To the bottom off. The core issue, right? Because sometimes what we think is wrong is not what's wrong, it's just our perception. So the organization is worldwide and different cities and and countries have their own chapters.

Vladimir: So we do have a chapter in Detroit, which is EO Detroit, and that's what I'm part of. And on top of that, we have regional and we have national and international events that I have attended as well, and built a lot of relationships with those people also. So when this happened, it is really hard to share something like this with people.

Vladimir: And then usually when you do share it with people, they try to give you the word of encouragement and, and things like that, and advice. And what I got from my forum was very different than when I shared with some of my friends. And that had to do with how we are trained to communicate. So when I shared, instead of just saying, oh my God, it's gonna be all right, don't worry about it, or.

Vladimir: It sucks. They started asking questions, how do you feel about that? Why do you feel this way? And by asking me these questions made me think deeper inside. And we were able to identify whatever issues that were making me feel fearful at the moment and help me deal with it. Quite a bit because you know, when it comes to like anxiety that we experience, there is a guy, his name is Dan, he's a Buddhist monk, and we had a conversation one day about anxiety and he said, so what anxiety is, is when your mind travels into the future, plays a video of the worst case scenario that could happen, then comes back to now and tells you that this is exactly how it's gonna play out.

Vladimir: Where in reality, usually things do not manifest that way, and therefore it's not how they play out. By drilling down on my feelings and why I feel certain way with my forum in combination with what Dante was saying, I was able to identify that whatever I think the worst. Case scenario might be, is probably not gonna be it anyways, so there is no reason to go there.

Vladimir: And that helped quite a bit. On top of that, during that time I had attended an international event. There was about 65 of us also through yo, and the environment was so safe that they felt comfortable sharing with everybody that my wife is diagnosed with ovarian cancer and, and the support I received from the group was monumental and a lot of times them being supportful or.

Vladimir: Asking questions is important, but sometimes it's just people being able to talk about it. Right. Without even getting feedback from people is also very important. It's almost like getting it off your chest 'cause it's, it's really hard to sometimes discuss that.

Sean Weisbrot: I'm glad that you had this kind of an experience.

Sean Weisbrot: I don't think it's something that most people get. I don, my dad had. And his aorta replaced about three and a half years ago, and my mom didn't have anyone to help her. And I know when we were in the hospital, she tried to be helpful, but she didn't really understand what was going on medically. And so my brother and I had to step in and, you know, we had to take care of her.

Sean Weisbrot: But through it all, she didn't have anyone except for my brother and I. And she didn't take it very well. My dad didn't take it very well. There were support networks that were available for people like him. You know, having this heart surgery. He chose not to go and I tried to get him multiple times to go.

Sean Weisbrot: He didn't want to go. My parents are, they have high EQ and high iq, and yet I felt missed out on an opportunity. It was kind of sad for me that. That's what they did. But I ended up kind of being the support network for them. I was making my dad's meals 'cause he had to be really careful what he ate for a long time.

Sean Weisbrot: And I was driving him to his physical therapy. So I was basically the support network and it was draining for me 'cause I didn't have anyone to help me. So I kind of felt like I was taking his health in my hands because nobody else could do it.

Vladimir: Yeah, that's a lot to put on somebody, especially a child.

Vladimir: Even though you were already older, you're still a kid. Interestingly, that the way I was raised, you know, and I'm raised in Soviet Union, so you do not show your emotion. You do not talk about your emotion. That's just nonsense. I am not the one. I would never be the one to talk about things like this, like I would never share, and so on and so forth.

Vladimir: Uh, the only reason I was able to do that is because of eo. As I joined EO and got trained to communicate in a certain way, and the more I practiced it, right? So if I joined in 2012, and this happened in 2019, that means I was practicing communication like this for about six and a half years. And I learned how to share.

Vladimir: Took me a little while, but you know, by observing other people's share and, and little by little sharing more of me, I learned how to do that. So by the time this happened, I already knew how to do that. If it wasn't for you, honestly, it would not be the same by any means. And my level of my own awareness would not be the same because that changed.

Vladimir: Through EO quite a bit also. So between eo between forum and books that I read every day, my level of awareness changed quite a bit. And you know, once you realize that anything that happens to you is not unique to you at all, it happens to other people and, and there is no shame in that. Right? But on the contrary.

Vladimir: As you talk about it, you actually do find people who experience the same thing and, and they may be capable of sharing something they did that helped them, or on the contrary, you can help them going through their experience in a better way, that becomes very, very powerful.

Sean Weisbrot: I was very fortunate that my parents raised me from very early. I, from what I can remember, as early as five. Every night when they, you know, were putting me to bed, they would say, this is your opportunity to tell me anything you want. There's no judgment whatsoever. I'll just sit here and listen, but whatever you wanna say, I'm here, I'm listening.

Sean Weisbrot: And they did this from what I can remember every night for many, many years. And so I never grew up with this fear of sharing my thoughts and my feelings with other people. I feel like it helped me. I. Become a good person who's capable of being patient and listening to other people. Because if you grow up with a parent who's very loving and warm, there's a good chance you're gonna grow up loving and warm.

Sean Weisbrot: Absolutely. And that's been actually difficult for me being in Asia because a lot of the women I've been in relationships with grow up with families where they're very cold to each other. Just the way that they communicate is not very warm and loving. There's a lot of making the kid feel like they're useless as a means to push them to try harder to challenge themselves.

Vladimir: So do Russian parents.

Sean Weisbrot: And so yeah. The relationships I've had with these women have been hard because sometimes they don't want to hear me share my feelings. They feel like it makes me less of a man because I'm willing to tell them how I feel. Where an American woman will be dying to hear this stuff from like their husband, I.

Vladimir: Correct. 'cause they don't know what to do next with that. And of course, a lot of times we are trained to think that asking questions like that is, um, intruding on people's privacy.

Sean Weisbrot: I think the reality is people want to be asked about these things. Yes. So the, the standard line in English is, how are you?

Sean Weisbrot: Yeah, I'm fine.

Sean Weisbrot: But that's not usually the answer.

Vladimir: That's not usually what it's.

Sean Weisbrot: Right. It's like, well, you know, my parents just yelled at each other last night for five hours and I couldn't fall asleep, and so now I feel like crap today. Yep. Or, well, you know, my father got drunk and beat my mother again for the millionth time.

Vladimir: Yeah. But I'm fine. Other ways,

Sean Weisbrot: right? People do a really good job of putting up a front to make it seem as if everything is okay. And I think the pandemic is making it so that people are a little more okay with going, you know what, I'm not that okay. Life isn't great and hopefully what we'll see from it is a deeper connection with other people.

Sean Weisbrot: I think technology has removed the interpersonal aspect of relationships. And I'm hoping the pandemic woke people up to the idea that like, maybe tech isn't as important and maybe we should be refocusing on people again.

Vladimir: Absolutely. I'm hoping for that as well. Because as you are right, pandemic did change quite a bit and I know with my family, it brought the family closer together because everybody was at home much more.

Vladimir: So we ate. Together more than we ever do. We did a lot of walks at night and just because kids didn't have their activities, we didn't have our activities. And uh, we had all this time and we came closer with our friends through the experience as well. 'cause we did see some of our friends through the pandemic and I hear a lot of that from other people as well.

Vladimir: So if at the very least families came closer together, that in itself is huge because that's the foundation of the society.